[Crm-sig] NEW ISSUE: Modelling provenance of Intangible Heritage

Massoomeh Niknia massoomeh.niknia at gmail.com
Thu Mar 18 13:20:22 EET 2021


Dear Martin, Rob, Pierre and All,



Thank you so much for sharing your opinions and solutions. They are so
helpful.

I am trying to implement another solution and it takes time to implement it
completely on my database.

I'll write you the results soon.



Thank you again for your consideration.


Kind regards,

Massoomeh




On Fri, 26 Feb 2021 at 02:29, Pierre Choffé <choffepierre at gmail.com> wrote:

> Dear Martin, dear all,
>
> We considered this interesting question of context and origin in the frame
> of the Doremus project. For example, we describe the creation of Henry
> Purcell's Music for the Funeral of Queen Mary, Z. 860 as an Expression
> Creation that occurred in the *historical context *of the death of Queen
> Mary II. The Expression itself has a historical context of Queen Mary
> funeral and a religious context of Anglicism.
>
>
> F22 Self-Contained
>
> Expression
>
> R17i was created by
>
> F28 Expression
>
> Creation
>
> F28 Expression
>
> Creation
>
> U56 occurred in historical context
>
> M40 Context
>
> “Décès de la Reine Mary II d’Angleterre”
>
> F22 Self-Contained
>
> Expression
>
> U63 has religious context
>
> M40 Context
>
> { Anglicanisme }
>
> F22 Self-Contained
>
> Expression
>
> U66 has historical context
>
> M40 Context
>
> “Funérailles de la Reine Mary”
>
>
> To describe a concert of Pygmy music at the Philharmonie de Paris :
>
>
> M42 Performed Expression Creation
>
> P7 took place at
>
> E53 Place
>
> { Philharmonie de Paris }
>
> M42 Performed Expression Creation
>
> R17 created
>
> M43 Performed Expression
>
> M43 Performed Expression
>
> U64 has cultural context
>
> M40 Context
>
> { Pygmées }
>
>
> Or a raga concert at Radio France :
>
>
> F22 Self-contained expression
>
> U65 has geographical context
>
> M40 Context
>
>  { Inde  }
>
> F22 Self-contained expression
>
> U54i has performed expression
>
> M43 Performed Expression
>
> M43 Performed Expression
>
> R17i was created by
>
> M42 Performed Expression Creation
>
> M42 Performed Expression Creation
>
> P7 took place at
>
> E53 Place
>
> { Radio France }
>
>
> M40 Context <http://data.doremus.org/ontology/#M40_Context> is a subclass
> of E55 Type
>
> U64 has cultural context
> <http://data.doremus.org/ontology/#U64_has_cultural_context> is a
> subproperty of *P2 has type*
>
> and you can check the other context properties in
> DOREMUS Ontology <http://data.doremus.org/ontology>
> <http://data.doremus.org/ontology>
> DATA.DOREMUS.ORG <http://data.doremus.org/ontology>
> <https://polymail.io/?utm_source=polymail&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=link-preview>
> <http://data.doremus.org/ontology>
>
> I hope this can help,
> All the very best,
> Pierre Choffé
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 25th, 2021 at 11:50 PM, "Pierre Choffé" <
> choffepierre at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Dear Martin, dear all,
>>
>> We considered this interesting question of context and origin in the
>> frame of the Doremus project. For example, we describe the creation of
>> Henry Purcell's Music for the Funeral of Queen Mary, Z. 860 as an
>> Expression Creation that occurred in the *historical context *of the
>> death of Queen Mary II. The Expression itself has a historical context of Queen
>> Mary funeral and a religious context of Anglicism.
>>
>>
>> F22 Self-Contained
>>
>> Expression
>>
>> R17i was created by
>>
>> F28 Expression
>>
>> Creation
>>
>> F28 Expression
>>
>> Creation
>>
>> U56 occurred in historical context
>>
>> M40 Context
>>
>> “Décès de la Reine Mary II d’Angleterre”
>>
>> F22 Self-Contained
>>
>> Expression
>>
>> U63 has religious context
>>
>> M40 Context
>>
>> { Anglicanisme }
>>
>> F22 Self-Contained
>>
>> Expression
>>
>> U66 has historical context
>>
>> M40 Context
>>
>> “Funérailles de la Reine Mary”
>>
>>
>> To describe a concert of Pygmy music at the Philharmonie de Paris :
>>
>>
>> M42 Performed Expression Creation
>>
>> P7 took place at
>>
>> E53 Place
>>
>> { Philharmonie de Paris }
>>
>> M42 Performed Expression Creation
>>
>> R17 created
>>
>> M43 Performed Expression
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 25th, 2021 at 7:44 PM, Robert Sanderson <azaroth42 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Very interesting!
>>
>> From the wikipedia article, the Radif is:
>>     a collection of old melodies that have been handed down by the
>> masters to the students through the generations
>>
>> Which is very interesting if taken literally as it requires *two* classes
>> we don't have -- a collection class for non-physical things [dare I say in
>> this context that yes I am banging that drum?] and a class for a Melody to
>> parallel Visual and Linguistic sub-classes of Information Object.  Once
>> there is a set of melodies, this can be the specific object of the
>> activities where the tradition is passed on.
>>
>> I wonder about the use of Type without further properties or activities,
>> as it's currently impossible to relate a concept to other classes.  An
>> example which came up here recently is the precoordinated headings with
>> temporal, personal and geographic facets ... for example "History (E55
>> Type) of 15th Century (E4 Period) France (E53 Place)". Clearly History of
>> 15th Century France is a Type, but one that should be able to be related to
>> the Period and Place.
>>
>> Rob
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 23, 2021 at 3:10 PM Martin Doerr <martin at ics.forth.gr> wrote:
>>
>> Dear All,
>>
>> Massoomeh Niknia from Kharazmi University| Tehran, Iran brought this to
>> my attention:
>>
>> "I have a list of Iranian Intangible cultural heritage works (E71) and
>> each of them has an origin from one or more than one province (E53) of
>> Iran. for example "Radif of Iranian music" belongs to a province which is
>> called "Khorasan".
>>
>> I would like to know how can I make a relationship between the works (
>> Iranian Intangible cultural heritage) to their origins. I suppose I need to
>> show their relations by making an special activity (like belonging,
>> influencing, etc.) but unfortunately I couldn't find such a property in the
>> Model. "
>>
>> See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radif_(music) and
>> https://ich.unesco.org/en/RL/radif-of-iranian-music-00279 .
>>
>> I think that we have o consider a combination of the LRM concept of Work
>> and modelling collective behavior. It may reach the limits of what we can
>> do with modeling the past by identifiable individuals. It may also be
>> regarded as an E55 Type? It should be connected to particular performance
>> modelling, particular artists, may be even particular instruments.
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>> Martin
>>
>> --
>> ------------------------------------
>>  Dr. Martin Doerr
>>
>>  Honorary Head of the
>>  Center for Cultural Informatics
>>
>>  Information Systems Laboratory
>>  Institute of Computer Science
>>  Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)
>>
>>  N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,
>>  GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece
>>
>>  Vox:+30(2810)391625
>>  Email: martin at ics.forth.gr
>>  Web-site: http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Crm-sig mailing list
>> Crm-sig at ics.forth.gr
>> http://lists.ics.forth.gr/mailman/listinfo/crm-sig
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Rob Sanderson
>> Director for Cultural Heritage Metadata
>> Yale University
>>
>>
>>
>> M43 Performed Expression
>>
>> U64 has cultural context
>>
>> M40 Context
>>
>> { Pygmées }
>>
>>
>> Or a raga concert at Radio France :
>>
>>
>> F22 Self-contained expression
>>
>> U65 has geographical context
>>
>> M40 Context
>>
>>  { Inde  }
>>
>> F22 Self-contained expression
>>
>> U54i has performed expression
>>
>> M43 Performed Expression
>>
>> M43 Performed Expression
>>
>> R17i was created by
>>
>> M42 Performed Expression Creation
>>
>> M42 Performed Expression Creation
>>
>> P7 took place at
>>
>> E53 Place
>>
>> { Radio France }
>>
>>
>> M40 Context <http://data.doremus.org/ontology/#M40_Context> is a
>> subclass of E55 Type
>>
>> U64 has cultural context
>> <http://data.doremus.org/ontology/#U64_has_cultural_context> is a
>> subproperty of *P2 has type*
>>
>> and you can check the other context properties in
>> DOREMUS Ontology <http://data.doremus.org/ontology>
>> <http://data.doremus.org/ontology>
>> DATA.DOREMUS.ORG <http://data.doremus.org/ontology>
>> <https://polymail.io/?utm_source=polymail&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=link-preview>
>> <http://data.doremus.org/ontology>
>>
>> I hope this can help,
>> All the very best,
>> Pierre Choffé
>>
>>
>>
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>


-- 
Massoomeh Niknia, PhD
Information Studies
Kharazmi University| Tehran, Iran
https://sites.google.com/view/niknia
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