[Crm-sig] Issue 277 "artist"

Martin Doerr martin at ics.forth.gr
Sat Mar 9 20:40:00 EET 2019


On 3/9/2019 11:22 AM, Nicola Carboni wrote:
> Dear Martin,
>
>> Nevertheless I like the "artist" example, because it is a vague 
>> attribution, but useful. Exactly the things we prefer to put in E55 Type.
>> I am intrigued by the different ways someone may be identified as 
>> artist. It reminds me the discourse about "my true mother" of George 
>> Lakoff in "Women, Fire and Dangerous Things”. The question is of 
>> course, if we could find an ontology as example which makes some 
>> objective ontological distinctions, such as people having studied 
>> fine arts, or being organized in a community of artists, or make a 
>> living by producing art. For reasoning with CRM classes, an 
>> interesting question is, if we can infer an artist from her products, 
>> or e.g., awards, without classifying the person.
>
> That is indeed a tricky definition, and I agree that should not rely 
> on an ontological commitment. In my opinion it should be dealt with a 
> set of rules formalised by each institution depending on their 
> view/culture reflect the conceptualisation of Artist.
>
> From a functional perspective, N3 is in my opinion the best way to go. 
> A brief example would be:
>
> {?X crm:P14_performed ?Y . ?Y crm:p2_has_type "exhibition".}  => {?X a 
> ex:Artist.} .
>
> it is pretty simple way to assign the class Artist to a person on the 
> base of a set of rules. Could that work?

Yes. I believe non-IT experts could best handle a graphical tool, on 
which deduction paths could be highlighted.

Even the "?Y.?Y" above is distracting.

The only problem I see is that current automatic RDFS graphical 
visualizations are cluttered with meaninglessly huge URIs and bad 
layout, huge arcs circling around.

May be someone knows a good intuitive tool?

Cheers,

Martin

> Best,
>
> Nicola
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> On 8 Mar 2019, at 19:36, Martin Doerr <martin at ics.forth.gr 
>> <mailto:martin at ics.forth.gr>> wrote:
>>
>> On 3/7/2019 11:02 PM, Robert Sanderson wrote:
>>>
>>> Martin, all,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> One thing to note about the dbpedia ontology is that it is derived 
>>> from the infobox sections of Wikipedia, mostly automatically.
>>>
>>> So this could be a very artificial alignment, and I would not put 
>>> too much emphasis on it as a precedent.
>> Yes, I see.
>>
>> Nevertheless I like the "artist" example, because it is a vague 
>> attribution, but useful. Exactly the things we prefer to put in E55 Type.
>> I am intrigued by the different ways someone may be identified as 
>> artist. It reminds me the discourse about "my true mother" of George 
>> Lakoff in "Women, Fire and Dangerous Things". The question is of 
>> course, if we could find an ontology as example which makes some 
>> objective ontological distinctions, such as people having studied 
>> fine arts, or being organized in a community of artists, or make a 
>> living by producing art.
>> For reasoning with CRM classes, an interesting question is, if we can 
>> infer an artist from her products, or e.g., awards, without 
>> classifying the person.
>> Best,
>> Martin
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Rob
>>> *From:*Crm-sig<crm-sig-bounces at ics.forth.gr>on behalf of Martin 
>>> Doerr<martin at ics.forth.gr>
>>> *Date:*Saturday, March 2, 2019 at 10:07 AM
>>> *To:*crm-sig<Crm-sig at ics.forth.gr>
>>> *Subject:*[Crm-sig] Issue 277 "artist"
>>>
>>> Dear All,
>>>
>>> For the test about types there was a question in which context a 
>>> class "Artist" may have been defined. I found one in dbpedia:
>>>
>>> http://dbpedia.org/ontology/Artist
>>>
>>> I am not sure how to refer to this in our text. One may point to the 
>>> utility of replacing classes with types for the mapping.
>>>
>>> Reading the properties of this artist definition carefully, one may 
>>> ask which of those are actually be restricted to artists, and which 
>>> "make artists" out of a person: the awards. The latter is obviously 
>>> common reasoning, but we would not populate the CRM with such 
>>> secondary concepts for reasons of maintaining a core.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> martin
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> ------------------------------------
>>>   Dr. Martin Doerr
>>>                
>>>   Honorary Head of the
>>>   Center for Cultural Informatics
>>>   
>>>   Information Systems Laboratory
>>>   Institute of Computer Science
>>>   Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)
>>>                    
>>>   N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,
>>>   GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece
>>>   
>>>   Vox:+30(2810)391625
>>>   Email:martin at ics.forth.gr  <mailto:martin at ics.forth.gr>   
>>>   Web-site:http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl  
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> ------------------------------------
>>   Dr. Martin Doerr
>>                
>>   Honorary Head of the
>>   Center for Cultural Informatics
>>   
>>   Information Systems Laboratory
>>   Institute of Computer Science
>>   Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)
>>                    
>>   N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,
>>   GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece
>>   
>>   Vox:+30(2810)391625
>>   Email:martin at ics.forth.gr   
>>   Web-site:http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl  
>> _______________________________________________
>> Crm-sig mailing list
>> Crm-sig at ics.forth.gr <mailto:Crm-sig at ics.forth.gr>
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>

-- 
------------------------------------
  Dr. Martin Doerr
               
  Honorary Head of the
  Center for Cultural Informatics
  
  Information Systems Laboratory
  Institute of Computer Science
  Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)
                   
  N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,
  GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece
  
  Vox:+30(2810)391625
  Email: martin at ics.forth.gr
  Web-site: http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl

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