[Crm-sig] Problem: the fakes

Simon Spero sesuncedu at gmail.com
Thu Feb 19 18:37:52 EET 2015

The  status of forged art works, and their description, has been much
discussed, (in sources which I do not have readily to hand - I need a
bibtex viewer for my tablet).

As best I recall, the most interesting questions are related to changes in
beliefs over time (diachronic doxastics?), as well as the relationship of
an earlier assumed creator to later believed (or known) creators.

The question of what it means for something to be a "Reubens", a "Fake
Reubens", an "Imitation Reubens", a "Replica Reubens" and a "work in the
style of The Painter Reubens" (TPR) are fundamentally ontological.

Both the "Reubens", the "Fake Reubens", and an "Imitation Reubens" are
"works in the style of TPR".

The first  Reubens has the additional property that the creator was TPR.

The Fake  work was created to induce a false belief that the work has a
certain identity, and a belief that the creator was TPR.
The Imitation lacks the intent to deceive.
The Replica is a work that is a copy of an existing work.

Depending on how one defines Fake, it might be possible for their to be
Fake Reubens that were created by TPR (if TPR created a replica of one of
his own works, with the intent of passing it off as the original). (A more
common case might be duplicate numbered prints (hand waving about whether
numbered prints are distinct works)).

It is possible to have a false belief that a work created by TPR is a Fake
(imagine finding a previously unknown Vermeer in one's attic in 1951).

Van Meegeren, père et fils, present an interesting test case for the new
model. It is easy to think of realistic questions that historians might
wish to ask a unified system-

What works in the style of Vermeer exist, in which collections?

  What are the paintings that are currently believed to be Vermeers?

What are the paintings that were believed to be Vermeers in 1938?
In 1951?
What paintings are currently believed to be Fake Vermeers?

What justification is there for these beliefs?
On Feb 19, 2015 9:14 AM, "martin" <martin at ics.forth.gr> wrote:

> Dear Dan,
> In case it is known to be fake, its creation is "influenced" by Rubens, and
> even "used specific object" the original, if it has an original.
> See, e.g. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Han_van_Meegeren
> for the difference.
> In case the similarity cannot be proven to be based on causal influence,
> it is "P130 shows features of".
> The fact that facts may wrong, is an epistemological question of
> maintaining
> a knowledge base, and not a question of the ontology. There must not be a
> property "isPhony", but a an annotation, and a mechanism to negate facts
> (any fact!).
> As annotion model, CRM-SIG has just approved CRMInf, which will be proposed
> to CIDOC as recommendation.
> Best,
> Martin
> On 19/2/2015 12:31 μμ, Athina Kritsotaki wrote:
>> Ηι,
>> I am wondering if this is a special case of the relationship "P130 shows
>> features of " between things? I am just wondering
>> RGs
>> ----------------------------
>> Athina Kritsotaki
>> Dan Matei
>>> Hi folks.
>>> Another problem: the fakes.
>>> Say: a fake after Rubens. In such a case, several predicates are phony:
>>> <crm:E65_Creation> <crm:P11_had_participant> <#Rubens>
>>> <crm:E65_Creation> <crm:P4_has_time-span> <#1620>
>>> etc.
>>> For this kind of statements should I use a .1 property "isPhony" ?
>>> Could anyone suggest o more elegant solution ?
>>> Dan
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Dan Matei
>>> director, Direc?ia Patrimoniu Cultural Mobil, Imaterial ?i Digital
>>> [Movable, Intangible and Digital Heritage Department]
>>> Institutul Na?ional al Patrimoniului [National Heritage Institute],
>>> Bucure?ti [Bucharest, Romania]
>>> Pia?a Presei Libere nr. 1, CP 33-90
>>> tel. 0725 253 222, (+4)021 317 90 72; fax (+4)021 317 90 64
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