[Crm-sig] ISSUE

Richard Light richard at light.demon.co.uk
Thu Feb 20 18:34:19 EET 2014


I'd be happy with "cultural and scientific heritage".  Presumably there 
is a certain amount of formality to be observed in updating the text of 
the CRM document itself, even the explanatory sections, given that it is 
an ISO Standard?

BTW, I'm currently keeping my promise to review the web site design: a 
"site map with comments" will be on its way to the list later today or 
tomorrow.

Richard

On 20/02/2014 15:48, martin wrote:
> Thank you! Sound good.
>
> In "practice", the real scope the CRM ended up with is human 
> activities and their products in the past and their current evidence. 
> We apply it quite successfully to scientific records ("metadata") of 
> all sciences, and Joao even referred to legislation activities. In 
> European Commission Jargon, they often talk about "cultural and 
> scientific heritage" in the framework of research funds.
>
> Best,
>
> Martin
>
> On 20/2/2014 2:31 ??, Richard Light wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> OK, thanks: I think I now understand what is going on.  The documents 
>> defining the CRM make reference to the web site page [1], noting that 
>> it provides more detail.  (BTW, the URL in the CRM footnote is out of 
>> date [2].)
>>
>> It looks as though the web page has [subsequently?] been updated so 
>> that it goes beyond what the CRM document says.  Your question is 
>> about "Practical scope", but in fact the web site Scope page broadens 
>> out the definition of "Intended scope" [3]. Clearly it would make 
>> sense for the two to be re-aligned, and I would support changing the 
>> "Intended scope" definition in the CRM document so that it matches 
>> the web page wording.   In addition, the bullet point wording on the 
>> web page has been updated, compared with the CRM document text.  
>> Shouldn't the two be the same?
>>
>> [This raises a more general issue: is it wise to include "quotations" 
>> from the CRM text as web page content on the CRM site?  As soon as 
>> you do so, there is the challenge of keeping the two versions in 
>> synch with each other, and/or of making clear to the reader which is 
>> the authoritative version.]
>>
>> I would make a rather different point about "Practical scope". I 
>> agree that it should have "museum documentation" replaced by 
>> "cultural heritage".  However, what interests me is that the wording 
>> in the CRM document [4] doesn't state plainly what is actually going 
>> on.  The wording isn't actually wrong, it just isn't very helpful.  I 
>> would prefer it if the document said "The Practical Scope^2 of the 
>> CRM is the set of /cultural heritage /standards /which //have been 
>> mapped to the CRM/. The CRM covers the same domain of discourse as 
>> the union of these reference standards; this means that /for/ data 
>> correctly encoded according to these /cultural heritage /standards 
>> there can be a CRM-compatible expression that conveys the same 
>> meaning." (changes in italic)  Then footnote 2 could say "The 
>> Practical Scope of the CRM is constantly increasing as mapping 
>> projects are completed. See http://www.cidoc-crm.org/scope.html for 
>> an up-to-date list of cultural heritage standards for which CRM 
>> mappings are available."
>>
>> Best wishes,
>>
>> Richard
>>
>> [1] http://www.cidoc-crm.org/scope.html
>> [2] "The Practical Scope of the CIDOC CRM, including a list of the 
>> relevant museum documentation standards, is discussed in more detail 
>> on the CIDOC CRM website at /http://cidoc.ics.forth.gr/scope.html/"
>> [3] "The intended scope of the CIDOC CRM may be defined as all 
>> information required for the scientific documentation of /cultural 
>> heritage /collections"
>>
>> On 19/02/2014 18:21, martin wrote:
>>> It is in the definition of the CIDOC CRM version 5.0.2 (.doc/pdf) 
>>> and older.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Martin
>>>
>>> On 19/2/2014 11:32 ??, Richard Light wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> Where is this quote taken from?  I don't find it anywhere on the 
>>>> page of the CRM web site entitled "Scope", with sections "Intended 
>>>> scope" and "Practical scope". [1]  That page "defines" "Practical 
>>>> scope" by listing all the data structures which have been mapped to 
>>>> the CRM.  Those data structures include library, archive and 
>>>> generic metadata frameworks.
>>>>
>>>> Richard
>>>>
>>>> [1] http://cidoc-crm.org/scope.html
>>>>
>>>> On 17/02/2014 20:13, martin wrote:
>>>>> Dear All,
>>>>>
>>>>> Should we define the practical scope of the CRM wider than "museums" ?
>>>>> I believe yes:
>>>>>
>>>>> "....the Practical Scope,
>>>>> which is expressed by the overall scope of a reference set of specific
>>>>> identifiable museum documentation standards and practices that the CRM aims to
>>>>> encompass..."
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Best,
>>>>>
>>>>> Martin
>>>>>
>>>>> -- 
>>>>>
>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>   Dr. Martin Doerr              |  Vox:+30(2810)391625        |
>>>>>   Research Director             |  Fax:+30(2810)391638        |
>>>>>                                 |  Email:martin at ics.forth.gr  |
>>>>>                                                               |
>>>>>                 Center for Cultural Informatics               |
>>>>>                 Information Systems Laboratory                |
>>>>>                  Institute of Computer Science                |
>>>>>     Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)   |
>>>>>                                                               |
>>>>>                 N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,             |
>>>>>                  GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece               |
>>>>>                                                               |
>>>>>               Web-site:http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl            |
>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Crm-sig mailing list
>>>>> Crm-sig at ics.forth.gr
>>>>> http://lists.ics.forth.gr/mailman/listinfo/crm-sig
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> *Richard Light*
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>>>   Dr. Martin Doerr              |  Vox:+30(2810)391625        |
>>>   Research Director             |  Fax:+30(2810)391638        |
>>>                                 |  Email:martin at ics.forth.gr  |
>>>                                                               |
>>>                 Center for Cultural Informatics               |
>>>                 Information Systems Laboratory                |
>>>                  Institute of Computer Science                |
>>>     Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)   |
>>>                                                               |
>>>                 N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,             |
>>>                  GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece               |
>>>                                                               |
>>>               Web-site:http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl            |
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Crm-sig mailing list
>>> Crm-sig at ics.forth.gr
>>> http://lists.ics.forth.gr/mailman/listinfo/crm-sig
>>
>> -- 
>> *Richard Light*
>>
>>
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>
>
> -- 
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
>   Dr. Martin Doerr              |  Vox:+30(2810)391625        |
>   Research Director             |  Fax:+30(2810)391638        |
>                                 |  Email:martin at ics.forth.gr  |
>                                                               |
>                 Center for Cultural Informatics               |
>                 Information Systems Laboratory                |
>                  Institute of Computer Science                |
>     Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)   |
>                                                               |
>                 N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,             |
>                  GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece               |
>                                                               |
>               Web-site:http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl            |
> --------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Crm-sig mailing list
> Crm-sig at ics.forth.gr
> http://lists.ics.forth.gr/mailman/listinfo/crm-sig

-- 
*Richard Light*
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