[Crm-sig] non-existent objects

[martin]

Dear All,

Supporting Thanassi, we have

a)

  E22 (the statue, including the setup)
       P2 has type E55 Type["Statue with setup"]
       P46 is composed of E22 (the setup) P2 has type E55 Type ["Basisplatte"]
       P46 is composed of E22 (statue proper) P2 has type E55 Type e.g. ["Statue proper"]

b)
E22 (the setup) P2 has type E55 Type ["Basisplatte"]  "don't know if ever had a statue"

c)
E22 (statue without) P2 has type E55 Type ["Statue without Basiplatte"]  "didn't use a setup"

d)
E22 (the statue, including the setup)
       P2 has type E55 Type["Statue with setup"]
       P46 is composed of E22 (the setup) P2 has type E55 Type ["Basisplatte"]
       p44 has condition E3 Condition State P2 has type ["Statue missing"]
				has timeSpan [?:NOW]

The "pre CRM" Max points to is not a CRM issue, but an RDF & Open World issue.
You can do it in RDF: You define all CRM properties again as "not", and interpret it
as three valued logic:
  
e)
  E22 (the statue, including the setup)
       P2 has type E55 Type["Statue with setup"]
       P46 is composed of E22 (the setup) P2 has type E55 Type ["Basisplatte"]
       P46N is not composed of E22 (statue proper) P2 has type E55 Type e.g. ["Statue proper"]

But then, you have to decide if you mean "never had" or when?

Best,

Martin

On 7/11/2012 5:17 μμ, Wolfgang Schmidle wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> I am working on Arachne's Cidoc representation, and we came across a
> problem with non-existent objects and how to state their non-existence.
>
> A statue may be set up using e.g. a base or a plinth. In Arachne this
> can be specified in a data field called "Aufstellung" ("setup"). One can
> choose a description from a fixed list, for example "Basisplatte" or
> "Fußplatte/Plinthe". Now, we could model it as
>
>       E22 (the statue, without setup) P46i forms part of E22 (the statue
> plus the setup) P2 has type E55 Type e.g. "Basisplatte"
>
> but I am told that the setup should be seen as a part of the statue.
> Consequently we are modelling it as
>
>       E22 (the statue, including the setup) P46 is composed of E22 (the
> setup) P2 has type E55 Type e.g. "Basisplatte"
>
> However, Aufstellung may also have the value "ohne Basis" ("without
> base"). In this case the second E22 would denote a non-existent object,
> and its Type "ohne Basis" would state the non-existence of this object.
> (If the data field is left empty, we make no statement at all about the
> setup.)
>
> Is this the right way to model it? And is there a problem in RDF with an
> URI for a non-existent object?
>
> Additional question: Does Cidoc have an opinion about the the exact
> meaning of E22 P46 E22 P2 E55 "ohne Basis"? Let's take the word "sheep"
> as an example, where the singular and plural forms are the same: one
> sheep, two sheep. Is it comparable to A) "while most words have a plural
> morpheme, the particular word sheep has none", or B) "for systematic
> reasons we assume that all words have a plural morpheme, but for the
> particular word sheep it is null"?
>
> Thanks,
> Wolfgang
>
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>
>


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